You are right to affirm that it has been some time between drinks from the reservoir of all things I am Jonny King, and for this I offer my unreserved apologies… in the words of the August [ine] Saint, It is better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all. They say that context is King, but I don’t wear crowns [presently], however with that quotation, one may ponder whether I have dethroned our hermeneutical helpmate, after all, the only love remotely connected with this blog would be the narcissistic-type from one frequently verbose blogger who likes to look at pictures of himself… now who could that be?.. I am not one to point the finger, but did you catch the pic-changer on the homepage. Alas, the long locks [that is photo 3 for all you uninitiated] have been traded in. The peer-est of peer pressures was all it took and I folded. What one will do for love… Yes, the wife had had [he says...sttttuttttttering] enough.
Before this moment moves me to soliloquies, and we all go to our happy places and think about trinu-corns (this is a sanctified moment, there will be no unicorns in this moment, that is far too modalistic a reality) and big fluffy clouds that are so warm and snugly… Editorial Note: For first time readers who are beginning to ask serious questions looking for serious answers, I would say one thing…Can salt water come out of a fresh spring?
As one band has said, Every new beginning is another new beginnings end, so read on, I am about to obscure my obscurantism and come clean… I have read the previous deliberations to the wife and she looked rather concerned, so you are not alone… help is the on the way, as I tell my other personality to get the Gehenna behind me!
Do not fear, I am just working out the kinks in my evolutionary search for blog nirvana, if I should live another 325 billion years on this earth, I think we should have these all sorted, by then we should have also moved on from such neanderthalic realities like disciplining our children, as I am hopeful that the model of that future reality will have such “smart” technology where such activity will be self-inflicted, a.k.a. we could call it adult-proof parenting!
After all, there is something that can be said for giving oneself a stiff uppercut, from what is unfolding with that French rugby player, this could be very well what happened to Mr Bastareaud.
Moving seamlessly on to some more mundane matters, I can confirm that I am not going through some mini crisis in my blogology… I am still a practising believer, which I trust this confirms.
Nevertheless, let me explain what has been happening in my world.
Welcome to my world… The reason for my blogging neglect has been due to a diversion of the most “academic” of sorts. Those who have completed a number of Tour of Duty’s may have read the “about you” page that is… well, about me, not you (so narcissistic).
I happened to drop a line that referred to completing some studies in theology in the near future, with that future becoming me present reality [least I trust it will], as I have been preparing - finishing my first essay for my first paper at Laidlaw=Carey… and they get paid to read this stuff… what a gig!
Therefore, I have been focused, head down, pressing my flesh to my keyboard-come-computer screen, desperately seeking to make the word count become flesh… Word Limits, the Bain of my guilt-free innocence. It probably does not surprise you that the first achievement of any paper that I complete is making the word really count [that is the word count when the extra % that the long suffering Prof. allows]. I was able to cross that line, and after some moodle-ing blues, I was able to send my paper to the unsuspecting Professor. Shame he has to mark it… I think they call that payback!
This is also why I refer to certain travels, as I am Jonny King is about to paint the northern Usurpers [Auckland] all red and black [Dan Carter, he's ours not yours]… and maybe a little pink, as I head to the land of the long rain cloud for a block course that starts this coming week [29th June]!
Therefore, this past week has felt something like a “laughing Sarah” moment, when I have been doing something that I planned many moons ago, and did not consider that so much subsequent water would then flow under my bridge. Yet here I am… giggle, giggle!
Where this will lead and how my health handles such a reality is in the lap of the only wise God who has my world, your world, the whole world, in His hands [you were at least thinking about breaking out into a song].
Therefore, if you are so enabled, feel free to remember one in your petitioning, as I seek to Soli Deo Gloria.
Moving seamlessly on, once again, there has been much in these past couple of weeks that has grabbed my attention, but I have been impacted by the events surrounding Zac Guildford and the reminder that it gives me, and God willing, you, as we contemplate in our final few moments together [this is not a sermon].
Zac Guildford is a very talented rugby players who has made great strides at a young age. He is a squad member of the Super 14 team, the Hurricanes, but surely his career highlight would have been winning the world U20 Rugby World Cup in Japan last Sunday Night (NZ Time). I certainly enjoyed seeing us deal to the whining Poms… again!
As celebrations were ensuing and the players were accepting their medals, the camera panned to a wide shot and I noticed a player taking his boots off, making his way to the Stands, some distance from where he should have been. Thinking that this must have been due to the joy of celebrating with family and friends, I did not think too much of it.
That was until I heard the report some hours later.
You see watching in the Stands were Guildford’s parents who consistently made the various pilgrimages associated with parents of sporting elites. However, Zac Guildford’s dad would not be able to celebrate the victory with his son, nor would he in fact see another game in his son’s sporting career.
What had alerted Guildford to come over to the Stand was the view of certain medics working on his dad, seeking to bring him back to this sphere of the land of the living. At the time Guildford had done his all, to help New Zealand win the World Cup, Mr Guildford was losing the fight to live a life that he so desperately desired.
At 44 years young, watching his son, Mr Guildford’s body had stopped… his life would be no more.
I don’t know about you, but the perverse intensity of emotions that is loaded into this real life narrative hits me full frontal with empathy for the Guildford’s, but also with a reminder that grace means that there is no guarantee that life is fair [from our perspective of this concept]. This life that we are getting is not in response to a job well done, it is in response to His job well done, and He is free to do with each and every one of us what He deems best. Such a picture may not fit our “gentle Jesus meek and mild” pamphleteering [Dr Merkley], but it is a true reflection on the nature of grace, the authority of the God of the Bible, and a rejection of the fable that we think we are owed something more in this life. God is well within His rights to both giveth and taketh away… period.
Therefore, we have got to right-size our Creator. He is no cooky-cutter Creator… He eats all the Cookies!
Our problem is that we fail to integrate such a perspective into our worldview, which means that when our “Joel Osteen” vision of the future gets hung and quartered, we not only get rid of the smile and manicured hair, but we call time out on God, after all, this isn’t how the life of a victorious Christian sounded like in the infomercial… Burn the T-shirt, and let the Book be burned into you… remember, you win in the End, when it really counts, which also means that He can be trusted in your present!
In this life, you will have divinely initiated paradoxical periods in your existence, where on one hand you will feel like you are in a world of hurt, unable to see through the darkness, unable to find a way out. It is at such times that you must hold on to the eternal truth that your Creator has a divine plan of hope for you, and by seeing above the present darkness and holding on to this hope, you will be better enabled to withstand the assault of pain that wants to drag you under.
This is not the hope of a momentary high, but the hope of an eternal moment when that momentary high will last a lifetime!
But, this is not all that I am reminded of…
I am reminded again on the transitory nature of this life, and the futility of an Hedonism without the Christian prefixed at the beginning!
Dwell on James 4:13-17
If one can get God’s perspective on this issue, one will be able to better handle the transitory nature of this life as one practically imbibes the forever assurance of a future eternity that will then also manifest itself in the transitory living of each and every moment of this present existence with the freedom that says this could be the last moment I experience such and such, and I can and want to make it count, thereby saying to a dying world that is denying, I can look fear in the face… and not blink, because this is not the end of the story, the chapters have already been written and I can’t wait to live the story!
Right size God and let Him right size your present… not only your future!
Soli Deo Gloria
Until Next Time
I am Jonny King
You wrote: “Our problem is that we fail to integrate such a perspective into our worldview, which means that when our “Joel Osteen” vision of the future gets hung and quartered, we not only get rid of the smile and manicured hair, but we call time out on God, after all, this isn’t how the life of a victorious Christian sounded like in the infomercial… Burn the T-shirt, and let the Book be burned into you… remember, you win in the End, when it really counts, which also means that He can be trusted in your present!”
The problem here is that you have not really done your homework. There are thousands of accounts of people whose faith in God have been strengthened at the worst possible times in their lives by Joel Osteen’s ministry. Your assertion is exactly the opposite of much of the antecdotal evidence, and there has never been a statistical study of this subject. So it’s basically your ‘gut feeling,’ which is fine, but it’s wrong. It sounds like you are really smart, but the assertion you make in the above paragraph doesn’t hold water.
Thanks for visiting my blog Don… and thank you for your comments.
I am sorry I have not got back to you sooner, but I am presently at a block course for some study in Theology.
Let me see if I can offer something in reply.
On the homepage, where each new post belongs, they sit under a title header that is referenced in each column with the term “opinion.” Therefore, what is posted is the opinion of I am Jonny King… God willing, this opinion will be both well-informed and well-propounded, but it is important to understand this. I tend to blog mostly off the cuff, and I try to make it both relevant and interesting to read, after all, there can be much to read at times.
In referring to Joel Osteen, the framing of my statement, in referring to getting rid of that Joel Osteen vision when it gets hung and quartered relates to times of trial and suffering (as the context should have affirmed). Read what Michael S. Horton has affirmed in a series that I would also encourage you to read. Here is what he said in the context of suffering…
The “health-and-wealth” gospel that Osteen preaches cannot deal with suffering. It is a theology of glory: the offer of the kingdoms of the world here and now. For those who take this path, it may well be that they will have their best life now. But even now, there is no place for suffering in this quintessentially American religion. Not Christ’s suffering for our sins or our suffering for being united to Christ. In a New York Times interview, Osteen was asked why there is suffering. Although he is correct that we cannot solve this dilemma philosophically, he offered no suggestion that it is solved in historical terms by Christ’s resurrection as the first-fruits of the new creation. “‘The answer is I don’t know,’ Mr. Osteen said. “‘We deal every week with someone whose child got killed, or they lost their job. I don’t understand it. All you can do is let God comfort you and move on. Part of faith is not understanding.’”
Quoted in “A Church That Packs Them In, 16,000 At a Time,” New York Times, July 18, 2005
Did you catch the line about why we suffer… “I don’t know.” There is much in the Word of God, as Horton makes clear, but also consider the reality of the Fall with the Hope of our soon-to-be redemption that could be spoken of here, there are examples of faithful sufferers, such as Job, with the paradigm that the book affirms for trusting in God… period… the example of Christ, and how He is also used as a paradigm for believers to copy, where suffering is used as a means for both growth and development… then, there are times when all hope is gone… what then… you call out in the words of Psalm 88, the darkest of all Psalms… lastly, what about reflecting on the character of God, the fact that He is our Father.
There will no doubt be other areas that could be affirmed, but I hope you get the message.
Really what Osteen has done is to throw his hands in the air. The reason he has done this is that his theology is deformative, which means that he can not integrate this vital part of all our lives into his worldview, which is why I encouraged readers to move beyond this to a more complete biblical perspective on the challenges and vicissitudes of life.
Therefore, I do not find Joel Osteen’s ministry to be both pragmatically effective in this regard, nor most importantly, to be reflective of a biblical witness to the one walking with suffering in their soul, which is why I can not endorse it.
Don, numbers or adherents are never a determinant as to whether something is right or wrong. God said to Jeremiah, you are going to do My will and preach My Word, and by the way, be incredibly unsuccessful… the key criteria in anything is faithfulness to the revealed will of God, which for us is the truth contained in the Word of God, which is why the sufferer can be successful in God’s eyes, because they can be faithful to where He has placed them, even though the world may think they are pitiful. God also said to Nebuchadnezzar that he was going to be God’s instrument in doing His will… this was no righteous ruler, but God’s will was achieved through this means.
Conversely, ask the adherents of Islam, Mormonism, or even Oprah, who is affirming some kind of spirituality if what they are doing/ following is working, positively affecting their lives. Most will say, “Too Right,” which is why they continue to drink the Kool-aid… this does not make what they believe to be right and should never be used as a means to judge whether something is right or wrong, which means, it should never be used as a “means test” to judge the veracity of the ministry and teaching of Joel Osteen or I am Jonny King’s blog.
Anyway, when all is said and done, an important point to affirm is that God’s working policy is one of grace. He works through frail, fallen human beings… Yes, thankfully, redeemed by grace, but still fraught with a captive disease (for His given time). This does not mean that this releases us from “doing” what is right or mean that we are free from critique or His revealed standard, but it does mean that God works in and through us, in many respects, despite what we are in practice, because of who He has made us positionally… in Christ, which also validates and explains why He can work through those individuals who are not necessarily affirming absolute truth in a given area, or at a given time, because when He views the man, he sees the imputation of Christ that vouchsafes that man’s present and future. This has to be understood in a nuanced way, so that it does not mean something it shouldn’t, as sin has its consequences, but perfection in performance can not be the basis. How far one has to stray is a good question to ponder on.
This also means that in what I am saying, I am not necessarily saying that God has not worked through the man, nor will work through his ministry, but I believe those listening will either grow and otherwise in relation to his correspondence with the truth of God’s Word, which is why I am concerned.
I ask you to read the two quotes that come up when you put your mouse over the 3rd picture of me on the pic-changer, one by Charles Spurgeon and the other by John Murray that express propositionally the difference between truth and error, and how close this can be… and how important is discernment.
I also invite you to read through the links from this website that offers some critiques on Joel Osteen. I have not read through all these articles, but I think they will offer you food for thought.
http://christiannews.co.nz/index.php?s=joel+osteen
I am not writing these comments out of a theory I have just learnt in a book. I have been unwell for some time with a long term illness that even as I attend this course affects and impacts the life that I seek to live. I would love it to go away… I can live with the reasons God’s Word has given me… can Mr Osteen!
I trust you find your times at this blog are both rewarding and edifying.
What do you think about giving ‘testimony’. You know, during church service, go up front and tell everyone in congregation that you have just bought a new mansion. Is it really Biblical? Is it some kind of ‘health and wealth’ thing?
It will encourage some/many in congregation I’m sure, but is it a wrong type of encouragement?
I too have long term physical condition by the way.
Good to hear from you again Bob,
I am sorry to hear about your illness, and I trust that you are coping, and that you have some good support. If it limits your ability to be more mobile, I am sure the internet is a blessing to connect with and through!
If I understand correctly what you are asking [please correct me if I am not], then your question about ‘mansions’ is based on Jesus’ words in John 14:2-3. Andeas Kostenberger [a scholar from the US] states that the context of this metaphor refers to heaven.
Therefore, if one was going up the front and speaking in this context, and using the certainty of a future reception of a mansion, i.e., Heaven, for God’s children, then it represents a biblical picture, and as a reflection of a purpose of metaphors, it can be quite vivid, and reflects what is a glorious future for those in Christ. However, it must be remembered that the term “mansions” or “rooms” as the ESV puts it, is a metaphor. I would be encouraging people to focus on what the metaphor points to, as this is where the meaning resides!
I don’t believe that it is the wrong type of encouragement as long as it reflects such a future reality. Hebrews 11:10 affirms that Abraham’s present faith, at the time of his earthly pilgrimage, had a future perspective, as it contextualised his time on earth!
The only substantial problem I can perceive is if someone has an understanding of these texts that is incorrect, as outworked in their theology and practice, which involves other contexts.
These affirmations about this future hope [see Titus 2:13] should encourage the believer in the present, not merely because of what it represents, but because of who is there, and as individuals who suffer in the present, it can be encouragement to persevere therein!
I trust this gets to the point of your question!
No, sorry I wasn’t being clear.
I mean like when a church encourages congregation to give testimony about their success in the world, e.g.: someone bought a new house, get a promotion, business success, pay rise, etc. Is that being vain or is that something that The Bible teaches?
No big deal about my illness. I suffer from polio on my left leg since I was 5. I get on with life just fine
I will do my best to be brief… and clear!
The short answer is in the context of what you are affirming, No, I don’t think that is a wise or the biblical practice, as it, (1) Puts the focus on material prosperity, where God puts the focus on spiritual prosperity [i.e., maturity in Christ] (2) What does this mean for those who don’t receive these possessions… Not enough faith? [If it is that God blesses people according to His will and way, which paradoxically, is often through suffering as well... then this is a little different] (3) Which means, this seems to move too closely into a retribution theology (and an over-realized eschatology, which brings some of the more material realities/ promises of the future, and try’s to apply them into the present), much like Job’s friends affirmed, which said… Job you are like this because of what you have done, or in your example, one has not received because of what one has done.
While it is true that God is the giver of every good and perfect gift [James 1:17], so in the wisdom of His will, some Christians are more prosperous/ gifted/ talented than others, such has not been the means of basing ones spirituality, is not the criteria by which God defines success, which means it should not be majored upon… Faithfulness to where He has placed one… which is why, unlike often in this world’s system, the sick and debilitated can biblically succeed, as they are faithful where God has called them. Finally, practically, nor should this be the focus when Christians meet together!
Now, while the above might not be the motivation for why the individuals have been asked to testify, I would ask the question whether someone who has suffered, for example, could be asked to do the same thing for the same motivation. If they have, then I would not be so worried, as it is not so much the mention of these things , but why, for what reasons, and the message that one is communicating!
The reason I put the “motivation” factor down is that one may be affirming that God’s grace has been seen in “gracing” me in certain ways and in certain means, which really applies to every believer, but looks different for each individual, which is why the motivation for deciding on the course of action could be due to lack of wisdom, or more problematic, due to an incorrect theology!
Therefore, the big questions for me are (1) Is this normative in the local church setting where you or any other believer is fellowshipping. If it is, then there is a reason, which points to some biblical deformity. (2) If this is part of an individuals personal testimonial narrative, it may be reflective of their growing understanding in God personally… and not the church, which means I respond differently. (3) If it is framed in the context of God’s grace, which is outworked differently for all, which means the focus is on God’s grace, then these material issues are not the focus, but extras in the desire to affirm God’s grace in one’s life, then such is also not an issue.
However, from your question, it seems you are referring more to number 1. If so, I would have reservations about what is transpiring!
Hope this makes some sense and answers your question!
“Is that being vain or is that something the Bible teaches?”
Sorry Bob, did not get to this part, which was the focus of your question!!! I know, what up I am Jonny King!
Simply, I would point one to 1 Corinthians 10:31, which affirms that even in the most routine of things, we should seek to glorify God! Therefore, why is one commenting on such things. It can be for the previous reasons [as affirmed in my last spiel], which are not correct, but if it points to God’s grace so that it becomes the focus, thereby glorifying God’s gracious provision, then I see no issue, as it relates to vanity.
But, very often, our motivations can be mixed, therefore, if I was giving my testimony, I don’t think I would want to be using this basis as a focused means to share God’s grace in my life. If such is the focus, it may point to something more significant.
Trust this helps!
Hi Jonny, thank you very much for that reply. It makes sense to me.
The church that I’m attending has a time for celebration where congregation is encouraged to share news like:
- new job
- new baby
- new house
- pay rise
- healing
- birthdays
- anniversaries
- when they bring friends
- winning competitions (sport, etc)
So not all too ‘worldly’ things I guess. And to be fair that this can be viewed as things that we do as a family.
I think I just want to know if this is something that The Bible teaches. I read The Bible, but I’m no scholar, so I like to ask questions. Since this is something I found quite frequently in churches (I’ve attended few different ones), I think about it now and then. And your mention of ‘health and wealth’ gospel kinda triggered this conversation.
Thanks for taking time to reply
I think you have correctly identified what is going on Bob!
From what you are saying it sounds like a time when the greater family can be tuned into what is going on in each others lives, helping to build community, which is so important, and can be a time of great joy and thankfulness for what God is doing!
You are more than welcome! I have much to learn as well Bob, so I don’t have all the answers, or even close to that reality, but it is my pleasure to be able to connect with you and help if I am able!
I look forward to hearing from you again!